well then...

Good catch Ron.

Great historical detective work Wally and some fine photography Capt. Chris! Nice work on the enlargement Ron.

The numbers on the reverse of the sheath certainly look hand worked (inscribed?) as opposed to stamped.

As I am not particularly familiar with vintage RMKs, or Johnson roughback sheaths, please permit me to ask some questions.

-What is the approximate/estimated creation date of this knife? 1950s?

-Do other Johnson roughback sheaths from that era have model and length numbers stamped on the reverse?

-If so, are they stamped in the same location as on this sheath (in the "butterfly" as per the Capt.)?

-If so, do the numbers have a similar look or do they have more of a 'stamped' appearance?

I cannot tell Ron. I know it would make no sense for someone to carve the wrong model # into a sheath...and: If it were a stock sheath at the shop, you would think, like all others, it would have been stamped. I see nothing finite, one way or the other Ron, but your point is valid. Welcome to the world of Randall Made Knives.
Best, Capt. Chris
PS: I know not of the dexterity or levels of imbibedness of Maurice Johnson so I care not speculate on that front...CCS

Bob,
The knife was made in the mid 1960's, in my opinion, no farther back than about 1964. The sheaths have been stamped in numerous locations and this one proves they can be different places. There is a possibility that, realizing nothing had been stamped to indicate blade length (or model #) Johnson's put these in, after-the fact?? Who knows? 1950's Model #1 sheaths would have been Heiser-made, brown button mostly.
Hope this helps, Capt. Chris

Bob,

Here is a 1950's version H. Hieser sheath along with a Maurice Johnson made sheath from the early 60's for comparison. The stamp is the telltale indicator. Hope this helps!

Bill / Bob: Thanks!

Cap: I'm damned near speechless after reading your reply! I typically don't re-hash minutia, but this stamp / no stamp thing is somewhat important if we're going to try and pigeon hole The General's knife to the best of our ability: Now this comes from Jack(nola) as I'm not smart enough to come up with this myself: The introduction of a model/length number stamp on Johnson sheaths occurred several months after the introduction of the baby-dot. This sheath is probably a case of the shop improvising an identification number to ID the sheath before Johnson began using ID stamps. The lack of an actual stamped set of numbers on this sheath still likely dates the sheath very precisely to early-mid 1963, say March-July. That would include the production dates between the introduction of the baby-dot (early-1963) and the introduction of model-length stamped numbers (mid-1963).
The dating of a sheath does not definitely date the accompanying knife, but it gives us circumstantial evidence regarding when Bo presented the knife to him.

Did you just call me Billy Bob??? lol

Thanks again Ron. Jack is a well respected authority on this era in Randall history, and a true gentleman!

Thanks again.

Good one, Bill! I love to laugh.

Thanks for tolerating my newbie questions, the plethora of information provided and the great photos. I've picked up a couple of books on RMK and I've been reading them, but I learn so much more on this site every day. This topic is a great one as it combines military history and RMK.

Could the Westmoreland sheath not be the original one from the RMK shop? I'm guessing that there's probably no way to know for sure. Does the knife itself appear to be an early 1960s Model #5? Do we have any idea when Gen. Westmoreland received the knife?