Miles Swelze James Behring Knives
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#145661 - 07/25/16 07:58 PM Re: This Old Randall * [Re: Dirty_Water]
Tattoo Bill Offline
Knife Enthusiast

Registered: 07/14/15
Posts: 1907
Loc: Spring Hill, Florida
Scott, You have four beautiful examples in the museum. They are something that I have often overlooked until I had the opportunity to buy this one. I'm extremely proud to own it, as anybody would be. Thanks for all that you do!


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Tattoo Bill
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#145662 - 07/25/16 08:30 PM Re: This Old Randall [Re: Tattoo Bill]
W Polidori Offline
Knife Enthusiast

Registered: 02/09/16
Posts: 5791
Loc: Central New York
Great find Bill and very rare considering the condition of yours. Don't know how you do it but you continue to press it!
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#145663 - 07/25/16 08:32 PM Re: This Old Randall [Re: W Polidori]
Tattoo Bill Offline
Knife Enthusiast

Registered: 07/14/15
Posts: 1907
Loc: Spring Hill, Florida
Thanks Bud! You know as well as I do, condition, condition, condition!
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Tattoo Bill
Spring Hill, FL.
Livin On The Edge!
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#145664 - 07/25/16 08:42 PM Re: This Old Randall [Re: Tattoo Bill]
maxpastor Offline
Knife Enthusiast

Registered: 07/31/14
Posts: 849
Loc: South West
you nailed it Bill, great knife, I think it is a biker's knife, ( Fighter, BBQ cutter and Beer opener ). doesn't get any better than that. cool
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#145665 - 07/25/16 08:47 PM Re: This Old Randall [Re: Tattoo Bill]
crutchtip Offline
Knife Enthusiast

Registered: 11/16/05
Posts: 2850
Originally Posted By: Tattoo Bill
Originally Posted By: crutchtip
Originally Posted By: Ronnie
It stands to reason that a guy going into the military in WWII could have used one of these knives during the war.



One did, it is documented on pages 138-139 in Hunt's "Randall Military Models", but to make a blanket statement that there was some sudden flurry of purchases by the newly formed UDT in its infancy is a dream at best. Even the inference this took place is disingenuous without any evidence to support it.

Most of the maybe ten or so I have seen were found in atackle box or kitchen drawer. They were not very popular being limited in their use and the expense. That was a pricey bottle opener back in the day!



You might want to read a bit further on page 138 about the original owner of John Cheek's knife.

For those of you who do not have access to Bob Hunt's book, here are the facts.

"Long before introducing the Model 16, Mr. Randall had designed a true saltwater diving knife, one of which is photographed here. The knife is interesting, but so was the man who used it. A pioneer in spear fishing and skin-diving in general, Hal Messinger was an underwater angler of some reputation before entering the US Navy during WWII."

"Subsequently he was elevated to a new position that put him in command of ALL combined forces of Underwater Demolition Teams (UDT). The organization was created through the influence of both the President of the United States and the British Prime Minister and Messinger's appointment was made on the recommendation of the OSS."

"As a Naval officer, he organized, trained and developed the UDT's, which led to their successful operations in clearing enemy waters on invasion shores. During his service, Captain Messinger developed procedures used to pick up SEAL teams from a moving boat"

"Hal Messinger carried the knife depicted during the war, but any reference to how and where it was used has been lost in time. Its unique design is devised from forging a 3/4-inch bar that was hammered and then ground to shape out of one solid bar of stainless steel. The result was a rustproof knife that held an edge and was ideally suited to the type of work IT WAS DESIGNED FOR."

To make the assumption that Capt. Messinger was the only member of all of these units combined that carried one of these knives, especially since he was in charge of training each and every last one of them, and that he would not recommend the use of one similar..... well that would be just asinine. I do not value anybody's snide comments or "mightier than thou" attitude, especially when it involves MY knives. I call it what I want because it is the only logical reason for it's existence.

If somebody would like to authenticate MY knife, send me $150.00 and I will allow them to look at it.


Just an FYI Bill, I an very familiar with John's knife and turned it down long before John owned it, partly because the service couldn't be documented. I know what was paid for it down the line from owner to owner. I know where it came from originally. You didn't even know what a Randall was when that knife showed up on the scene. Your knife is no more a UDT knife than you are an astronaut. All I did is ask you to produce evidence to your claim and you didn't, only relying on literary license exercised by an author.

That slippery handled knife that Messinger had problably saw little if any actual use in service. Maybe in his spearfishing ventures, gutting a fish, or cracking open a beer, but not combat related. That is pure speculation from Bob when he wrote the book, and he took some liberty in that description particularly when he said "Mr. Randall designed a true saltwater diving knife", which we all know is not accurate. It was never designed as a diving knife which would not come until 1958.

I also quote "any reference to how and where it was used has been lost in time". What a shocker. My guess is Messinger for most duty purposes carried the standard MK 2 as did most, and IIRC there was a "special" plated version available often attributed as being used by UDT's.

This is once again a case where what someone wants to believe overrides any logic or evidence, which there is none. It is not enough that it is a nice knife/sheath that is relatively uncommon that some folks would like to see. It has to be more.
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#145666 - 07/25/16 08:52 PM Re: This Old Randall [Re: crutchtip]
Tattoo Bill Offline
Knife Enthusiast

Registered: 07/14/15
Posts: 1907
Loc: Spring Hill, Florida
And you have to step in and spew your hate as usual. Your opinions hold no water with me. Period. I will continue to buy these museum quality knives and leave the culls for you, which you seem to like better. Move on and try to impress somebody else, because I'm not selling it to you. Good Bye!
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Tattoo Bill
Spring Hill, FL.
Livin On The Edge!
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#145668 - 07/25/16 09:02 PM Re: This Old Randall [Re: Tattoo Bill]
W Polidori Offline
Knife Enthusiast

Registered: 02/09/16
Posts: 5791
Loc: Central New York
Originally Posted By: Tattoo Bill
Thanks Bud! You know as well as I do, condition, condition, condition!


No, more like "I got one, I got one I got one". Amazing stuff. What are you doing tomorrow? Lol.
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#145669 - 07/25/16 09:05 PM Re: This Old Randall [Re: W Polidori]
Tattoo Bill Offline
Knife Enthusiast

Registered: 07/14/15
Posts: 1907
Loc: Spring Hill, Florida
Raiding YOUR safe! lol That's where all the treasures are!
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Tattoo Bill
Spring Hill, FL.
Livin On The Edge!
ta2bill@yahoo.com


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#145670 - 07/25/16 09:07 PM Re: This Old Randall [Re: Tattoo Bill]
W Polidori Offline
Knife Enthusiast

Registered: 02/09/16
Posts: 5791
Loc: Central New York
Take your chances. I like my odds.
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#145671 - 07/25/16 09:10 PM Re: This Old Randall [Re: W Polidori]
Tattoo Bill Offline
Knife Enthusiast

Registered: 07/14/15
Posts: 1907
Loc: Spring Hill, Florida
errrrr............off to Chief's house then! lol
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Tattoo Bill
Spring Hill, FL.
Livin On The Edge!
ta2bill@yahoo.com


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